WHERE HAVE ALL THE C GRADES GONE ?

Discussion in 'General Airgun Chat' started by holly, May 9, 2019.

  1. Brian.Samson

    Brian.Samson Allowed in Sales Staff Member

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    not everyone it would seem :D
     
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  2. DazF

    DazF Active Member

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    PMSL :)
     
  3. holly

    holly Well-Known Member

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    Twas in a early Air Gun World , in the 80s . bit before your time . . the numbers and a picture of a line of shooters waiting to shoot . plus a report of shooters waiting for the wind to settle before they shot . not happy . yeah i have seen a shoot off at lea valley that was done with head lights . that was back when it was a FT club . different days . at one of the Hertford hundred shoots . a fella turned up with a quad on a trailer and shot most of the course from that . did not hit much as i remember . don't quite think that would fit in now . shame . i can see croucher shooting off the back of a camel . ??? HOLLY
     
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  4. Ratinator

    Ratinator 77.74

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    Even Camels have standards ,Holly.:D
     
  5. Welsh Wizard

    Welsh Wizard Testing Testing!! Staff Member

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    Mmmm, I could shoot off the back of a Rhino and Holly and Ass lol
     
  6. Ratinator

    Ratinator 77.74

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    Poachers would be the least of a rhinos problems with you sat on its back . Their used to Ox peckers not Welsh peckers .:D:D
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2019
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  7. holly

    holly Well-Known Member

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    True Rat . and it would have to be a very strong camel too . talking of odd . one lad in days gone by shot from a wheel chair . there was quite a stink about it from some . cos he used to shoot with his rifle over his bean bag off his lap . he always started well but about half way around got really tired . and the misses started up . shame nice lad . everybody had to help to push his chair around the course . ??? HOLLY

    PS and one fella used to shoot off a milk crate . Ernie .
     
  8. Evo

    Evo Scouser by Birth mfta shooter by choice

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    I bet he never shot blaenau gwent in his wheelchair , but on a serious note,well done man city lol
     
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  9. bootneckbob

    bootneckbob Active Member

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    How can you look at this graph and say FT is doing better than HFT!!!!!!!!!!!! I have to go now but will be back. You got to love stats.





    [​IMG]
     
  10. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Probably because the red line is above HFT.

    But I don't think that was the point that was made, it was that HFT has seen numbers fall as well as FT.
     
  11. scutter

    scutter Aspiring to mediocrity

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    Evening all, Sorry to butt in, but I am just a bit confused about the numbers, The graph looks wrong, in 2004 the sport of HFT was still quite small and it has grown and grown. Yes over the last few years there has been a small drop off in numbers in the Nationals, but this has been down to the amount of comps their are. In HFT, just in my local area we have the UKAHFT Nationals, the SiHft, Southern Hunters as well as each club has open events at least twice a month. In HFT you can shoot every weekend and often have a choice of two or 3 events. The Worlds which has 360 spots sells out in weeks and this Sundays National is sold out with 180 shooters attending. So, I don't see how the sport can be percived as being in decline.

    With regard to AirGunner and coverage in the magazines, this is probably down to me, in part. I have worked for AirGunner for 10 years and I am a HFT shooter, I tried FT, but my hips killed me and I could not continue. From a writers point of view, I am not going to travel hundreds of miles just to report on a shoot, I want to get some enjoyment out of it and take part. This is why HFT is easy to write about for me, I can rock up, take part, and then write about the day. Most writers for AG just do it for fun.

    Also, in any HFT field, there will be lots of shooters with stock guns, this way I can get plenty of pics of people with Air Arms, Daystates etc and this keeps the manufacturers happy and if they are happy, they advertise more and that makes my editor happy.

    With regard to C Grade, when I tried FT, I found it all a bit over whelming and I was an experienced HFT shooter. The guns, scopes, jackets, hooks, levels and all the other paraphernalia was too much, the people were great, but for someone coming into the sport, shooting FT is like beginning motor racing and starting in F1.

    So, how about this, instead of a C class, how about a beginners class. Stock guns, basic scopes, no jackets, hooks. Keep the price down and limit the time you can be in it to one full season. Make it so shooters can come along with a stock gun and have some fun. This could help people come into the sport of FT and not have to spend to much money.

    Hope this helps

    Gary
     
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  12. Gary Martin

    Gary Martin sultans of spring

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    here's a thought, maybe just maybe C graders don't want to shoot GPs, as they want to do the regional series first.
     
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  13. nat

    nat Member

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    And that concludes this thread superbly :)
     
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  14. Brian.Samson

    Brian.Samson Allowed in Sales Staff Member

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    The numbers are the number of individuals taking part in the UKAHFT series - the numbers are available on the UKAHFT website (although you may have to manually count them or download the tables into Excel).
    Last year 248 individuals took part, no data point is entered for 2008 because the figures aren't available, so the line goes from 2007 to 2009 without a datapoint in the middle.

    It's entirely possible for 180 people to attend an event, since it's from a pool of 248. What the graph shows is the trend of the net total of people - so it shows that more people leave the UKAHFT series each year than join it. Although the average attendance at each round was 130 in 2018 and the highest attendances were at MAD with nearly 150. You're not seeing attendances of 180 anymore.

    It doesn't mean the sport as a whole is in decline, it just means that fewer and fewer people are taking part in the national events and probably prefer to stay and shoot local events. Much the same as the trend we're seeing in FT too.

    Here's the data it's based on ( from the UKAHFT website ) :

    2004 519
    2005 480
    2006 365
    2007 366
    2008 ??
    2009 387
    2010 390
    2011 352
    2012 304
    2013 286
    2014 307
    2015 301
    2016 293
    2017 278
    2018 248

    2018 Attendances :

    R1 - 137
    R2 - 125
    R3 - 134
    R4 - 148 ( Double header at MAD )
    R5 - 144 ( Double header at MAD )
    R6 - 118
    R7 - 124
    R8 - 112
    R9 - 130
     
  15. Brian.Samson

    Brian.Samson Allowed in Sales Staff Member

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    No one ever suggested such a thing, in fact the exact opposite was claimed :-

    It's even more difficult to look at that graph and claim that HFT is doing better then FT, I'm sure you'll agree.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2019 at 9:32 PM
  16. bootneckbob

    bootneckbob Active Member

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    Yeah, sorry I'll completely agree I was rushing earlier and misread the graph. The line through me at a glance as the UKAHFT one goes back further than the BFTA one so my brain saw the graph the the other way around. Granted, according to the graph FT is doing better than UKAHFT.

    I would agree with Scutter though. I don't shoot UKAHFT anymore but still shoot HFT (and FT) at regional level.
     
  17. Gary Martin

    Gary Martin sultans of spring

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    glad to have been of service. looking forward to kneelers now! bring it on.
     
  18. Brian.Samson

    Brian.Samson Allowed in Sales Staff Member

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    I don't have any data on it, but from my gut feeling and own experience I think there's a trend in both sports to prefer local shoots to national ones, and I think the reason is that there's more regional shoots now.

    I started shooting HFT back in 2003/2004 and back then there were only the UKAHFT rounds, so if you wanted to have a go at HFT you had to shoot the nationals and most people just shot the ones local to them - that's why we saw numbers in the 500's.

    Now it's only the really serious few that shoot the nationals - also I think part of the drop was that in 2006/7 petrol prices went through the roof and also the UKAHFT introduced pre-booking for the events and they got booked up almost a year in advance.

    I think both sports are doing ok - yeah they could do better, but since both sports are just amateur events run by unpaid volunteers, there isn't the structure to support an increase in numbers.

    The problem we have now is that there are too many shoots and it's almost impossible to find a free Sunday - we never had that problem back in 2004, and that might very well be the reason that back in 1989 they had to shoot by car headlights too.
     
  19. bootneckbob

    bootneckbob Active Member

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    I'd agree with that Brian. I've stayed off this thread but commented elsewhere on it (Facebook) that the name is partly responsible for the lack of C grade shooters. Grand Prix by definition is top level competition so C graders would probably not feel encouraged to go and rather stay at the regional level. Personally I don't see anything wrong with that.
    I used to shoot UKAHFT but stopped as I was finding it too much of a drain of my weekends (only time at home) plus the cost of fuel. I was lucky enough to have a few good courses nearby that I could shoot at weekly instead; Nomads and Furnace Mill mainly. Since moving down to North Devon I've taken up FT within SWEFTA and also still shoot HFT (although it's not to UKAHFT rules). I still don't shoot nationals in either discipline as the travel (and cost) is just too much for me. I wish all those that have the time and capacity to do it well; for me I'm happy that we have good regional courses.
     
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  20. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Yep, there's definitely a lot more shoots on. One of the reasons I started this site was because it was hard to see what was going on in one place, and there seemed to be conflicts or complete gaps. In some parts of the year I could go weeks without a competition. I used to drive to the midlands for something to do or try out something in between league shoots.

    Now petrol is more expensive, and Sunday I can shoot a league at one of my clubs, another league in my other region. There's at least 2 other leagues within striking range, and one of them also has another club shoot within their region. There's also an annual open in my region 20 miles up the road from my club. The weekend after is a double header weekend. We haven't even spoken about trips abroad!

    One one thread we've got someone complaining they can't get into a GP on the session they want.

    I don't think it's possible that FT will please everyone, but at least it's still providing opportunities for everyone who wants to do it. Albeit you might have to get in quick if you want to into some competitions. At least the Worlds aren't like that this year :)
     

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