Re The number of places in the Worlds.

Discussion in 'Hunter (HFT) & Field Target (FT)' started by Gcos, Oct 23, 2012.

  1. Gcos

    Gcos Member

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    We are all aware of the lack of places in the Worlds this year. I have been giveing this further thought and was wondering if this idea (no ***** please ) might help to alleviate the situation. Why not when you register you elect to shoot in 1 class only regardless of how you do in the overall competition.
    You could then have the Juniors, Ladies and Vets and even the springers shoot in a second session( in the afternoon ?). The result of this would be to increase the no of PCP places in the overall competion . the Juniors , Ladies and Vets ,springers can all go. Dont reply saying how long it will take because if you really want to shoot the Worlds you can start at 5-00 inthe morning if necessary.
    If any Junior Lady has the top overall score , she doesnt have to worry about the prize I will buy her an EV2 .
     
  2. villiers

    villiers Self appointed antipimp

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    The rest of the world shoots to slowly, most worlds courses take all day with the 3 mins per lane.
     
  3. Gcos

    Gcos Member

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    Don, I requested in my post that the issue of time could not be a consideration. Why have you you done this. Why not come up with an alternative or any suggestion to increase the no of places in the no of places.
     
  4. loopyloo

    loopyloo Member

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    TIME IS ALSO A FACTOR NOT JUST NUMBERS PLUS MANPOWER

    I HOPE YOU ARE VOLUNTEERING TO MARSHALL ALL DAY :D


    Because i dont fancy starting shooting at tea time thanks i like shooting when there is daylight. :eek:


    SEE I DIDNT MENTION THAT SHOOTING THE WORLDS TAKES HOURS AND HOURS :rolleyes:

    LOOPY
     
  5. villiers

    villiers Self appointed antipimp

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    I did on one of the other threads hold a worlds junior champs only open to under 21 at the moment and as the sport becomes more popular they will have to break it up as they way they run worlds there is just no time and space to increase the numbers with the 3 mins per lane .
    I would love everyone to be able to go but they way it's going it's just not going to happen. I know I have very little chance going and I will just have to get use to the fact.
    Don
     
  6. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Several reasons, in my personal opinion.

    Juniors, Ladies, Seniors don't all want to be segregated. Some of them do well in the open class on their own. I know what Helen would say. I'd take a good guess at what Francois and Craig would have said. Mr Taylor qualified as a Senior in Italy. And I think the chap from the US got a top 10 as one this year.

    There's not enough Juniors, Ladies, Seniors, Springer shooters to fill a session, or that can't be controlled to happen (unless you want to limit them somehow). So some Male PCP shooters will overflow into that other session because otherwise places are wasted and that would be counter productive. There'd be even less JLSS's if those shooters who wished to shoot in the open elected to do so.

    Sessions are pants. Italy showed what different weather conditions you could get, and I'd hate to have seen someone divided by them over a title.

    The EFTA have already suggested 3 methods to enable more competitors (because sessions have taken 6 hours to complete). This has been mentioned at least once on this forum.

    1) Reduce time in lane, which was voted out (2.5 mins)
    2) Reduce targets in lane to 1.
    3) Add another day with another course

    BDS have ruled out 2&3 as they cannot take more shooters than the 300 they have allowed for and have not enough time for a 4th day. I have no idea of what NZ have in mind, but i'm guessing that over subscription may not be such a problem for them.
     
  7. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    I think I may have done, but I don't know if I will get away with it. :D
     
  8. Gcos

    Gcos Member

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    Don, re para 2 the last sentence. If you dont go to the Worlds no one will be going. Am I talking to the same Guy that can qualify for the England team and can also shoot for NZ in the Worlds if you want to.
     
  9. villiers

    villiers Self appointed antipimp

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    I nailed my flag to the England pole this year in Norway this year , i am a simple chap and if there are ten places i have to earn one of those places i will shoot the inters and bfta champs and do my best .If i went back to NZ and lived there and shot in there series and qualifier series and did OK then i would feel like i earned the place and not stole it from someone else who deserved to go because they are better and had a proper chance of winning something.
    Don:)
     
  10. Neil-T

    Neil-T Boingers forever.

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    Well said that man. Respect where it's due. Really hope you qualify by your own merit. Shoot well. Neil.
     
  11. Gcos

    Gcos Member

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    My thoughts are that I have given a possible solution to alleviate the shortage of places at the Worlds.

    Re. Para 1. Segregation of the various classes . Its simple ,just ask them if they would like to shoot in their own class at the Worlds or stay at home. With regard to Helen what would she rather do again, stay at home or be with you SHOOTING. What are her chances of qualifying for Germany with the current qualification criteria. Since when did Francois and Craig ,Ian Taylor and a Gentleman from the US , and their thoughts have any bearing on WFTF policy or your thoughts on getting more people to the Worlds..
    Re.Para 2. Theres not enough other shooters from the other classes to fill a second session . Thats great ,you wont have to start shooting in the PCP open at 5-00 in the morning.Whats all this about overflow of PCP shooters going into the second session ,we have taken out Juniors .Ladies ,Vets , Springers and that has created further places for them. How many places do they want (all of them).
    Re.Para 3.Sessions are not pants at all. If all shooters in their class shoot the same time ,whats pants about that.
    Re. Para 4. No comment .It didnt work.
    Re.Para 5.The BDS cant take more than 300 shooters ,they can , its either they dont want to or they have not seen this proposal.
    I have given a possible part solution to the problem and your arguments against it are are rather disapointing .It appears that you keep passing the buck back to the WFTF instead of trying to resolve the matter with them. I cannot understand Why you dont want the other classes to be represented at the Worlds.
     
  12. loopyloo

    loopyloo Member

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    Ive bitten my tongue like so many people on here and i hope not to step over any mark. BUT


    HOW DARE YOU SAY ROB IS NOT WILLING TO BE OF HELP.

    I tell you hes put more into this than you would ever know behind the scenes is not a pretty sight. We have 30 country's opinion of what we want from the game and getting everyone to understand and agree is like mentioning the crono or disability at a BFTA meeting.:D

    I have shot for many years in the worlds and never made the team yet but i try year in and out to qualify all the same. I am lucky and honoured that the BDS have let those whom gained podium places in. I shall still try to be in the team all the same. Now are you saying i shouldnt take this place as ive already got one.

    300 places is alot we have never come close to that amount before but because of where this is being held and more countries being involved its likely that the places can be filled.

    HOW DO YOU KNOW THEY CAN TAKE MORE OR NOT WILLING TO HAVE MORE? please tell

    THERE ARE NO ACTUAL SEPARATE CLASSES JUST A RECOGNITION OF WHETHER YOUR LADY/JUNIOR/SENIOR/SPRINGER/PCP WITH A TROPHY AS A THANK YOU.

    If you try to segregate them most will still be trying to shoot with the main stream. That frees no places at all. Plus stats will have more to sort out.

    This is where your mistaken you cant segregate them I am a lady(oh yes i am) with a PCP and i know of at least 3 ladys one a junior that shot springers so exactly where do we file them.
    They turned up we didnt have any other ladies go and no junior wanted to go either.

    This year maybe different we have set the criteria so all those juniors and ladies that want to go just fill it then your one step nearer. Ive looked at the registration seems there arent as many wanting to go as much as they say they want to as we have the regular few who have put there name where there mouth is.

    I feel we will all be able to go (as alot of those that make noise do nothing and just wanted to sound off) and that we are moaning about nothing. :eek:

    We all are shooting for the title of World Champ. Every shooter should all shoot at the same time we have seen how sessions in a GP can change. This makes it equal for all.

    Ok shall stop now

    Loopy
     
  13. Conor

    Conor Never been banned from sales Staff Member

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    Germany only have been given permission for 3 days to use the Nationally Protected forest they are using for the Worlds.
    Volker has asked the local council and the local infrastructure in Ebern cannot support any more than 300 for that weekend.
    It's a 300 capacity shoot.
    They also don't have the funds to pay the marshals to administer two sessions per day which would ultimately require stats people, admin chrono check etc so man power would be on huge demand.

    The WFTF is getting silly and will reach a point where there is no solution to resolve the huge problem of getting everyone there who want to go. There is no easy answers to the issue of accommodating the numbers for all the different classes.
     
  14. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Generally I tend to like to consider the effect on people if i'm forming an opinion, so asking Helen who is sitting next to me was an easy start. Who have you considered the effect on, or does that not really matter?

    Her answer was stay at home, **** that. She wouldn't be happy staying at home nor would she be happy getting an attendance trophy. She does not agree at all with sex segregation in the sport. She's added she doesn't shoot to be with me, she shoots anyway, and that her chances of qualifying are the same as anyone else. She'd be very unhappy about beating everyone and not being world champ. She want's to win on her merits not be put in a special class because of her anatomy.

    She's added if you want it under her account name, she'll do that as well, she feels so strongly.


    Seeing as there aren't enough shooters of the JLSS's to fill a session, and you want to remove more from the pool, why not offer Male PCP shooters the excess? Or are you suggesting that Male PCP shooters should be limited? Your proposal was about getting more shooters to the event wasn't it? There isn't enough demand from JLSS to fill a session.
    Out of the 170 registered shooters there are a total of 30 JLSS shooters in Germany so far.

    Making an event into sessions shouldn't change the make up of who would be in those sessions just to get them into it... what's the point of making sessions, excluding people, just so you can have a gap that you can fill with a demand that doesn't seem to be there. Many of the shooters who fall into JLSS do so because it's a by-product of their attendance, not their sole reason.


    Which hasn't happened yet.

    Here is the reply from the BDS, that you doubt has been made, or that you just seem to doubt. I find that quite offensive that a shooter from England would do such on a public international shooting forum, but nevertheless, here it is;

    2.1 of the core rules covers the amount of targets per lane.

    The course the BDS have chosen does meet the ideal laid out in the core rules, of 3 courses of 25 lanes each with 2 targets. They were not asked to consider 4 courses, or 3 courses of 50 lanes with one target beforehand. I personally feel that the BDS have made every attempt to put on the best event they can. We have continually requested the WFTF look at a solution to cater for more shooters.

    I suggest that if you wish to take these matters up further, that you do so via your regional representative, or with the EFTA Chairman. If you continue to call into question my integrity or that of another you will lose the ability to post here without further notice.
     
  15. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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    Registration is creeping up, I guess more than 300 can register but only 300 will get places?


    Registered names

    Germany 55 (hope they got some left to marshall :)!)
    Italy 36 (think thats more than shot in Italy:eek:!)
    Englad 36 (not sure if welsh Big Dave has registered with you lot by mistake?:confused:)
    Poland 18
    Hungary 13 (Fred is down as team shooter, so again not now trying for England?)
    Wales 12
    Usa 12 ( Ian harford in Usa team so i guess he wont now be trying to qualify as english team member?)
    Portugal 11
    Slovakia 10
    Belgium 10
    Holland 9 (Big Berts crew)
    Spain 9
    Croatia 9
    Estonia 7
    France 7
    Norway 5
    Malta 5 ( all blokes - boooo)
    South Africa 5 (guess there are more to come?)
    N.Ireland 4
    Lithuania 4
    Argentina 3
    Canada 2
    Irland 1
    Scotland 1 (Kilty, otherwise known as the Bank of Craig and Dan :D)



    Notice on Bda website says payment now open with March deadline for teams, I think?

    Just hope i can find a hotel near by for the Taffies and Friends on tour 2013
     
  16. fireblade

    fireblade Team AirArms

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    Hi simon, were did you get your info from?

    Fred and ian Harford as far as i understood, are trying to qualify as team england,
    (not that its a team event though:rolleyes:),

    i thought / was informed, once someone has registered for one country, they could no longer apply for another? (which if they did/had, would be in my opinion, very unsporting and just plain wrong, so this info couldn't possibly be correct?, or is it :eek:)
     
  17. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Ian is shooting for USA. He is taking his info off the bds website where Ian was incorrectly entered.
     
  18. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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    Indeed, i was checking the welsh entries and expanded.

    Like my belly did over xmas!
     
  19. fireblade

    fireblade Team AirArms

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    So does that mean andras will be comming off our list as well, as he is registered for hungary?.
     
  20. Dieter K.

    Dieter K. New Member

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    My crystal ball can not predict something.

    I can only add it to the list which is filled out at registration. ;)
     

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