Discussion in 'Hunter (HFT) & Field Target (FT)' started by Danladi, Jul 16, 2009.
Very well presented Brian, it will be a great help to many .... thanks!
Brilliant! Your a top guy for sharing
Cheers again for the info, I've been to two hft shoots so far scoring a 52 and then a 55 the week after. Well pleased!
It's also very clear which shots I need to work on which is a bonus. It tends to be the close-range reduced targets that i struggle with. The problem is that the aiming points differ so much even between an 8 and a 10 yarder. And a 15mm killzone isn't exactly forgiving
With that said, bracketing at close range seems alot more effective for range finding.
Are there any other tricks for range-finding to within a yard at close range?
All the answers are in the rangefinding manual
15mm kills aren't legal under UKAHFT rules sub 13 yards - and a 13 yard 15mm kill is a pretty straightforward shot - just aim at it.
The smallest kill sub 13 yards is a 20mm and thankfully they are a bit more forgiving than a 15mm. If you check Chairgun or your own holdover charts you should be able to squeeze a pellet into a 20mm kill if you play the odds on range - basically aim top of kill and it should take it down unless you have quite high mounts.
For rangefinding, ranging by eye is about the most accurate and reliable method on the really close ones and even if you're a couple of yards out you should still be able to sneak a pellet into the kill.
From the manual, you could also try the pacing the target out trick - by imagining the target to be on an arc and just extend that arc out onto the shooting line and then pace the distance to that point.
What you'll find though is one of the main reasons people miss the really close ones is parallax error - that's a whole other subject.
Well done on your scores btw
Lads you'll not go far wrong from listening to old man Samson, he's quite possibley the best at adopting technical information and then putting it into practice. Top man.
Rool Of Fumb Feory 4 .177in cal PCP Rifle.
Point Blank Zero for a sniper type powder burner is 350yds + allowance for bullet drop at proposed total range to target this obviously will be a variable.
Point blank zero for a serious sub 12ftlbs Air gun is 35yds, Coincidence???
Set rifle at 35yds then check at 10 yds, correct any crossover,
note pellet drop at 10yds
This gives very close to the same aim point from 10 to 35yds,
40yds horizontal reticule aligned at top of target area
50yds 1 mil dot elevation aligned top of target area
6yds 1 mil dot elevation aligned middle of target area
This will get you through the early days, untill you can digest and utilise the superb info on this thread
If you aim straight at every target between 10 yards and 35 yards - don't be surprised if you don't knock many reduced kill targets over
I'm guessing that if you're reading a thread on rangefinding, you already realise that though.
A number of people have asked me to produce a bracketing chart for different magnifications - i.e. you may have a scope that has true mildots at 16x mag, but you want to shoot and range find on 12x magnification for example.
I've attached my mildot calculator spreadsheet to this post for you to use to produce one yourself.
In the top left hand corner of the spreadsheet you'll see true mildot mag and preferred shooting mag - just enter the magnification that your scope has true mildots at and the mag you want to shoot at. They're both set at 10 and 10 to start with.
The main spreadsheet itself has Mildots down the left, and yards along the top - the numbers in the chart are the size of the object you want to bracket in mm. For the example I've given in this thread we were using the hinge to the centre of kill zone - which is about 110mm.
So to use the chart you look up 110 (or as near as you can get) in the main chart for each yardage - then read across to the left to see how many mildots it is.
You might notice that some of the mildot's are missing!.. 1.3, 2.3, 3,3 etc.. There was a reason for this, but don't worry about it.. you can always just change the 1.2 to a 1.3 and the spreadsheet will recalculate instantly.
You could also use this spreadsheet to make up a range chart for 15mm kills, 25mm kills etc etc..
Hope this helps.. I really can't stress this too often though - Don't rely on mildot bracketing as a primary method of range finding.. use it as a last resort if all else fails.
Bri mate that's brilliant, I have often wondered how you did all of that! Cheers mate, it's like being given the Keys to the kingdon
very helpful thread, need all help i can find.
Great read Brian, thanks for sharing!
The mildot matrix chart is a must have for anyone shooting any known size targets!
One question though, how do you make those handy Butler Creek insert charts? I would love to be able to make my own up for my setup!
I use CorelDraw to produce mine, but any vector drawing package capable of rotating text will be fine.
Thanks again Brian!
Just had a loy thro definalty a lot of thought going into ranging etc
I pretty much only ranged by eye when i shot CSFTA HFT but ranges where 3 - unlimited and no restritions on hole sizes etc (or shape) used a mental image of my back garden range to step the ranges of various points to the target and obsitcals then knowing my trajectory on the mildot ret x 10 @ 40yrd zero easy to check how much play you have in the kill zone if you range wrong
never really had a problem with close targets should be money in the bank
I Agree with everything Brian Said!
I Believe Brian pointed out basically everything i can think of for range finding, There's a Perfect quote which is from Jarhead, "You take what you know, and then you multiply. Please don't use your dicks. They're too small, and I can't count that high. I don't wanna hear, "400,000 inches.", So in theory - You could measure out a Small spot of land which you know well, and then use that as a rough guide, This is what i do and its never failed me, least i not forget, Remember that Lighting of course affects range finding, along with dead ground between you and your target, By dead ground i mean ground which you cannot see, due to it being lower than you - Of course you have to account for Wind as well, Which is 99% Luck and 1% Knowledge - However i'll say no more, Correct me if I'm wrong, but good luck in HFT!
From experience (mainly in FT) I would say that reading the wind is a skill and that a rating of 99% luck would not account for the same faces that always seem to do well on windy days.
Agreed Dave, It's strange how it's the top shots who do well in the wind, if it was all down to luck at least one or two would have won the lottery by now
well chaps i regard myself as a fairly good ft shot ,but i struggle ranging in hft . dont have a problem with wind its the ranging that kills me .
wind has to be learned and sometimes you edge your bets .there is an element of luck but in my opinion its a small percentage .
now all i need is a good ranging method in hft .
Sorry lads but, In my own personal experience with no disrespect intended because your opinions are highly respected on my behalf and theres always something to learn but i believe wind in some situations on timed shots is a major factor of luck, Especially when your target is say for instance a Squirrel Standing straight at about 45-60 yards, Thats hunting however which is really a different ball game so of course that doesn't count.
Wind can at times be "un - judge able" especially down here in Wales, where we have a lot of valleys, Wind is also on and off and all you have to do is fire your round, wind drops, and thats either a Zero or 1, Just trying to point out where im coming from so again please dont take any offence and give me some feedback on what you think - Thanks.
Give it another year and see if you think the same. As above though if it's luck why do the same faces always appear at the top of the pack?