Marshalling...

Discussion in 'Hunter (HFT) & Field Target (FT)' started by RobF, Jun 26, 2012.

  1. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Not meant to be exactly FT specific, and certainly not meant to start one of those handbag FT/HFT threads...

    My personal opinion is FT needs better marshalling. Now before I start, i'll quantify that... i'm just as bad as pulling anyone else up on something as anyone else, but there are people that are better. One of my issues with buddy marshalling is that if you've created a bad atmosphere lane 1 then it's going to be a long shoot. But then you get people with rhino hide that don't care, or people that do it right so it doesn't matter.

    So, my thinking is that FT needs some permanent marshalls... which totting it up, becomes a lot.

    If we say 1.5 hours is a stint, for every post we need 4.

    So to man the chrono, that's 4 people.

    Each kneeling lane, 4 people, x 3 lanes = 12.

    Say 1 roving marshal, so that's another 4.

    Permanent BFTA chief marshal.

    That makes 20 marshals + the chief.


    To incentivise I would suggest fuel contributions, and to select the best, a marshalling course. It costs me about £20/30 to car share to most GP's so i'd say £30 is fair..? that would cover the cost of a room if need be on most shoots...? Perhaps a imileage could be worked out?

    Or of course we can continue saying about "what if there was" on rule threads.

    Permanent chief marshal to be voted on.


    And of course this is just airing on a forum, it means naff all until a proper proposal is taken to the BFTA and voted on. But it might help to hear people's thought's beforehand.
     
  2. AIRFIX GILLY

    AIRFIX GILLY WFTA World Champion 2012

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    Agreed

    I`d agree that the marshalling system in FT needs an upgrade for certain. Although I would suggest that the host club appoints all required marshalls for that day. The club hosting does get a lot of money for putting a GP on so they should cover the marshalls. A point to raise is that most marshalls on the coarse dont even know the rules and are only there to mend faulty targets. The marshalling at GP level in my oppinion is very `easy going` to say the least. Photos that appear on STB prove that competitors do break rules of the sport and get away with it. Fair and honest marshalls that know the rules is whats needed and wont be affraid to point out errors to people.:)
     
  3. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Agreed Andy. The issue I see is getting them. I know 20 might be ok for the bigger regions to deal with, but the smaller ones would struggle. My own (2) i'd see probably not even fielding 20 shooters to a GP, aside from which some of the regions are quite a jaunt. It's 80 miles to my nearest GP, and that's not in my region. It's 300 mile round trip the the GP venue this year and I think it was further last year. I'm not grumbling because I enjoy the shooting, merely trying to point out that for some regions, the man power would be difficult to find, let alone entice.

    One could argue that's the region's responsibility to provide it, or else they don't get a GP... but to be honest i could only see MFTA and NEFTA being possibly able to carry a marshaling team as large as i've suggested is required.

    I know there is an issue because on that high kneeler my bum was touching bag (not in a Midlander's kind of way), and i had to shift to get it off... yet as I settled, not one of the perhaps 8-9 people behind me said anything. That's not a criticism of those around, because at the end of the session concentration is bound to be low, but i'm just highlighting the issue.

    It's very well to complain and say something is not good enough. What i'm trying to do is perhaps shape a solution that could be offered to the board to look at.
     
  4. DarrenQ

    DarrenQ New Member

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    I think FT could learn a lot from HFT :)

    Sorry could not help myself in both fields it seems to be the same old people helping out and the same old people going home early after they have shot.
    Not that is a problem but it would be nice for some of the shooters ( you know who you are to try to make an effort).

    Thanks Darren.
     
  5. CAC

    CAC Member

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    Might be time to look at the "double header " idea again .....
     
  6. CAC

    CAC Member

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    .... Sorry bit premature again !!! Regions with big memberships eg NEFTA / MFTA may be able to cope with the required amount of Marshalls and a double header would cut travelling costs !!!
     
  7. Conor

    Conor Never been banned from sales Staff Member

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    Is that a region hosting two different 50 target GP courses over a weekend at the same club?
     
  8. CAC

    CAC Member

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    No Conor , two different clubs , it was mentioned at a few shoots as a way of reducing travelling costs and freeing up weekends for clubs to put on open shoots .

    Suppose clubs could be in adjoining regions as long as accommodation is pretty much adjacent to both, and it would spread the marshalling responsibilities .

    I know a few travellers who would be up for that idea :):)
     
  9. Conor

    Conor Never been banned from sales Staff Member

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    Sounds good to me but would the logistics work Alan.
     
  10. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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    As everywhere is a long way from North Cornwall, I think it's an excellent idea.

    Atb,

    Alec.
     
  11. CAC

    CAC Member

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    I know there was a bit of discussion at ground level ,but don't know how realistic it would be , but for some of us it would be a fantastic idea ;) I would suspect if your down for the weekend then you would be only too happy to do a marshalling stint on the Sat as your not looking at a 200/300 mile trek home !!
     
  12. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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    I would be glad to help out with some marshalling on a two day shoot. As things are now, after shooting a GP course my only thoughts are the 5 or 6 hour drive home!
     
  13. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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    Some clubs may get alot of money for putting a Gp on. not all. we will get a £1 a shooter so i presume with drop outs about £130 ish quid.

    For the amount of work that goes into a gp its not worth it?However, I am not doing it for the money though it will benifit my club a small amount.

    I still say the only people that shopuld be marshalling in regards rules are your shooting partner or partners.
    Club marshalls wll have terain knowlage and thus should be more suited to go and check a target in perhaps hazzordous terain (Tondu cliffs an example) and the chielf marshalls descision is final on any rules, broken, bent or otherwise , thats why he/she is there.
     
  14. AIRFIX GILLY

    AIRFIX GILLY WFTA World Champion 2012

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    All ok then

    So reading your post you must think marshalling is currently fine and dandy and therefore needs no ammending??:confused:
     
  15. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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    If you cant pull someone up when they break a rule Rob then i dont see why you expect anyone else too.
    If i am shooting with you and constantly say have muzzel behind the line or you think i am not doing a kneeling shot incorrectly, surley its going to create a "bad atmosphere" if you let me carry on doing it through the shoot if you dont pull me up on it? Your going to think i am cheating every time i take a shot?

    Personally i dont think there are many people breaking many rules in the Gp.
    My photos prove nothing in most instances as only I know when the photo is taken in regards to the shot, then not even me when its the camera on self timer. Only video gives true evidence of what happened on a lane. If the weather is ok, I may well be producing a DVD of Tondu as a BBc cameraman friend of mine is lined up to work for me on the day as a cheapish favour.

    the photos are only here as photo records of ourselves shooting. thats very important to me and i dont do the pics (free of chearge :)) for any other reason.

    I watch allot of shooters in the opposite session i shoot at Gps and have not seen much worthy of mention.

    I cant see 20 marshalls a shoot ever working unless they come from outside of FT ala paid track marshalls at circuits etc
     
  16. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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    I saw no problems at anston.
     
  17. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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    Double headers


    I suggested double headers for this season but it was put back.
    as such, its on the agena for the november AGM.

    If a club has a large enough ground to put on two different 50 shot course it could be the same club hosting it, other wise it could be a region where clubs are not too far apart, say about 15 -20 miles?.


    ie i think emly / redferns in nefta, Tondu / oaktree (1 mile apart) in wafta etc

    I am not sure there will be a scottish gp next year so that could well be the opener for trying double headers.

    Bank holiday sunday + monday dates being ideal?
     
  18. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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    Marshalling / gp shooting parnters

    its my opinion that at a gp where possible your shooting partner(s) should be from the same class as you are, ie Spring, AA, etc.
    Thus, they are more likley to have in interest in how you are shooting and making sure your not getting any advantage?
    as such, for gp6 Tondu, where i can i have put shooters from the same grades together.
    There is no real guidence in setting shooting partners come gps, just wondered what GP shooters think?

    keep team mates apart?
    keep Club mates apart?
    Keep friends apart?

    no one would ever have a partner if we tried to do all the above!



    I know in the past when i was in C -A grae and shot with higher grade shooters i felt intimedated by the "better" shots and would not have said anything to any one better / in a higher grade than me even though i have seen things that i know broke rules.
    I once shot with a well known AA shooter at Bisley in a gp a few years ago and his first two shots on the chrono were hot, I saw him squeeze the pellet on the third with out the marshall seeing it and he went through.
    At the time i would not have deared say anything as i was i think in C grade but even i knew that was against the rules
     
  19. Ratinator

    Ratinator 77.74

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    double header's

    Just wondering if any one that is up for a double header weekend,has run the idea past the misses yet?
    It's ok if your kid's are at the age were they don't speak to you anyway,it's also ok if your partner shoot's also.
    But for me one every fortnight is fine.
    I think there are enough double header's as it is,with the nefta classic,inter regional's the showdown,euro's.
    Back to subject,totally agree with gillie's post.
    If a club is big enough to host a GP they should be able to provide marshall's.
    It's ok saying you do not see issue's at GP's but how many shooter's do you observe as a shooter.
    If you are a static marshall you see every shooter.
    Looking forward to the tondu shoot,cause i think there will be a few kneeler's missed with the marshall's watching.
    simon francis 21311
     
  20. Neil

    Neil MFTA Winter League Champion 2011 and winner of som

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    I think there should be more rules, or at the very least, less ambiguity in the present rules.

    Rules are worthless unless they are enforced, so proper marshalling has got to be the way forward.

    This sport that we all love will never be any more than a load of blokes pissing about with pop guns unless we sort ourselves out with a comprehensive rule book, which is rigorously enforced.
     

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