Kneeling rolls

Discussion in 'General Airgun Chat' started by AIRFIX GILLY, Jan 21, 2016.

  1. AIRFIX GILLY

    AIRFIX GILLY WFTA World Champion 2012

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    Question... Is NEFTA or any other region allowing it's regions members the option of using a kneeling roll (no bean bag just Matt under knee) at winter league shoots?
    Even though no rule for diameter or length have been finalised by BFTA.

    Have been asked by a MFTA member if he can use one at MFTA winter leagues.
    I'm not sure if it's correct to allow or not?
    Any sensible thoughts?

    Gilly,:confused:
     
  2. maddog

    maddog Active Member

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    Kneeling roll

    I can't see why not, if your bag can be 4 " then will the roll be 4" ,if one regen can trial it why not another the moor that try the roll the easier it will be come voting time for the rep's.
     
  3. Ratinator

    Ratinator 77.74

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    Rules

    I enjoyed having a go with the roll that Shaun supplied at Greyhound and found it very good. I also think it is a good idea to try this before a firm rule is set in place. But if the current BFTA rules don't say they can be used then I feel we should shoot to rule.
    Having said that at some point it sounds like that's all we will be allowed to use , so why not.
    Maybe the MFTA could provide one for 1 kneeling lane so people can pick and choose, that way any advantage is available to all involved.
    Simon
     
  4. Air Armed

    Air Armed MFTA Secretary

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    Brian Samson's been using one all winter league Gilly. It was decided at the AGM that if individuals wanted to use one in preparation for the Worlds then it was allowed provided the dimensions were in line with WFTF guidelines

    Paul
     
  5. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    The BFTA rules do allow them, but I'm not sure when they come into effect.

    In any event, for CSFTA FT I think if someone approached the comp sec and asked to use one, i would suspect the decision would be favourable.
     
  6. Ratinator

    Ratinator 77.74

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    Way forward

    I did say IF Rob

    To be honest I think they are a step in the right direction if it puts an end to all the talk about bags.
    It will have to be accepted at some point so why not allow a trial.
     
  7. DeanB

    DeanB Active Member

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    I think Brian posted that the roll could be up to 15 cm diameter. Also, he seemed to indicate they could have a flat bootom. No mention about the shape of the top. Are the rolls being tested made from exercise rolls or are they like a sausage=shaped bean bag?
     
  8. Yorkshiretea

    Yorkshiretea B Grade Bandit

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    Mix of yoga rolls and home made, some round and some rippled with a flat underside. Round works better foot side up I've found.
     
  9. DaveRobinson

    DaveRobinson NEFTA Chairman

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    Its going to be discussed at our next NEFTA meeting when we sort everything winter league related
     
  10. Shaun

    Shaun Moderator Staff Member

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    Hi all,

    Already posted elsewhere but I will reiterate the BFTA position

    It was voted that there would be no change to the BFTA rules about kneeling.

    However, it was agreed that shooters could use ankle rolls to establish opinions upon their future use.

    This means that rules for the use of rolls will be defined in the Main Shoot Rules for 2016.

    Briefly, any ankle roll will be allowed but you will not be able to use a bag when using the roll.
    If you wish to provide your own flat mat to keep your knee off the floor then that's fine.


    Present BFTA rules do not prevent the use of a roll but it's assumed that a bag is used.

    If you want to start experimenting with a roll now then that's fine just don't use a bag as well

    Shaun
     
  11. Mr P

    Mr P Active Member

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    So if bean bags are outlawed for kneeling on will the knee pads be banned also as i don't use one so anyone that is using one gets an unfair advantage assuming they are not worn for aesthetics?

    Steve:confused:
     
  12. The Inkerman

    The Inkerman Banned

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    Are these roll mat things used under the ankle of the foot nearest the backside ? Sounds like an old army style sitting position if they are !
     
  13. Shaun

    Shaun Moderator Staff Member

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    A good point Steve. The original idea was for the BFTA to provide the roll and a soft mat.

    If bags were outlawed then I'd anticipate that BFTA would provide soft mats on each kneeling lane. Whether use of knee pads would then offer an advantage I do not know. I hope that the next few months brings information from which sensible proposals can be formed.

    Yes Paul, the roll supports the arch formed by foot and shin

    Shaun
     
  14. Darron

    Darron Trainee Dwarf Slayer

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    I like sausage rolls but im not that keen on fig rolls:p
     
  15. The Inkerman

    The Inkerman Banned

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    Yes Paul, the roll supports the arch formed by foot and shin

    Shaun[/QUOTE]

    Old style army sitting position basically then ! :rolleyes:
     
  16. Brian.Samson

    Brian.Samson Allowed in Sales Staff Member

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    I missed this thread because I've been a tad busy lately.

    Anyhoo - yes I've been trialling a kneeling roll throughout the NEFTA Winter league, we also had one available on the kneeling lane at our last Winter League event for anyone to try out if they wanted to.

    As Shaun said - at the AGM the BFTA agreed to allow the use of a kneeling roll at BFTA events (which will require a rule change).

    My kneeling roll, isn't a kneeling roll at all. It's just a legal seat as defined in the NEFTA rules ;)

    I also asked permission from the Comp Sec and as it gives me no advantage whatsoever and it meets the definition in the rules of a legal seat it was agreed that I could use one for the Winter League.

    It meets the definition of a legal seat because it's 4 inches in diameter, any bigger and it would require a rule change to allow me to use it (as the BFTA agreed to do for the Main Shoot rules this season).

    btw - the WFTF definition of a legal kneeling roll has now been increased to a max diameter of 18cm.

    > PHOTO OF THE KNEELING ROLL IN USE <

    I should add, that if you look at the photo it should be pretty bloody obvious that a roll gives me no advantage over other shooters. Especially other shooters who use a mahoosive beanbag under their shin which puffs up and also gives lateral support as well. I'm not trialling one to gain an advantage, I'm trialling one because I'm the Head of Marshalling for the WFTF and I've got to train all future WFTF Marshals regarding what to look for when marshalling a kneeling lane at the World Championships. If i'm going to be delivering a training course for marshals in Portugal this year, it would really help if I had some first hand experience of actually using a kneeling roll so I can figure out if it's possible to cheat using one (so far, I've found that it's impossible to cheat)
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2016

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