HFT rules on Butt hooks.

Discussion in 'UKAHFT Official Forum' started by Mr H., Aug 29, 2016.

  1. Mr H.

    Mr H. I am not even a number.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    163
    Location:
    Halesowen.
    Club:
    NARPA - OSS. - Harriers FTC. British Field Target Council - Pre BFTA
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  2. scutter

    scutter Aspiring to mediocrity

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    2,013
    Location:
    braintree
    Club:
    MEMBER OF M.A.D
    The bottom arm can't be more then 2 1/4 " if that helps.
     
  3. Tench

    Tench WHFTA World Champion 2016.

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2009
    Messages:
    1,719
    Location:
    derby
    Never carry your shooting partner by his/her butt hook! :eek::D
     
  4. vinny

    vinny WHFTA 2015 World Champion

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2014
    Messages:
    685
    Location:
    essex
    Club:
    M.A.D
    I would recommend you check a few previous posts by mr dutton(scooby) regarding this, as scutter says 2.25 inches for both paddls I believe, not just the bottom one , this is taken from where the paddle leaves the vertical inside face,
    could be a bit ambiguos with an Skp as there are no straight faces, but in the interest of good sportmanship , if you take the p, you know whats coming,
    I recently asked a well known lady shooter how she, s getting on with her new gun, the reply was ,

    I cant make my mind up if the butt hooks in the right place, ...........my scars are still healing, lol
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  5. Mr H.

    Mr H. I am not even a number.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    163
    Location:
    Halesowen.
    Club:
    NARPA - OSS. - Harriers FTC. British Field Target Council - Pre BFTA
    Oh I have no intention of taking the P. The butt hook belonged to Dave Harrison and I wanted to use it for FT which I can and I fully intend to take up HFT as well. With the same rifle and scope. So I am trying out Nomads and getting back into the swing of shooting. So the obvious question is "Can I or not?? Obviously the armadillo rod is removed as in the other photo.
    I left air-rifle shooting back in 1996 after 14 years of committees - Club / MFTA / EFTA / BFTA and I have come back to 2 separate FT disciplines - disappointed to say the least. Back in 1991 we recommended that courses had 2 targets on 5 easy lanes - 1 for AA shooters and one for others i.e. 1 target at 40mm and one at 25mm. Obviously it wasn't passed. That would have made an interesting course.
    But hey ho things move on.
    So is there any chart or some such to show where to measure from and you say 2.5 inches total? and from which flat.
    And as for trawling through the thousands of posts Pete has done - well that's why I am asking the question.
    The other reason is I want to enter the competition on Sunday down at the Nomads and I would hate for someone to object and all the problems that brings.
    Because of the design no-one was sure.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  6. DEAN C.

    DEAN C. Steyr Convert

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2009
    Messages:
    852
    Location:
    Doncaster
    Club:
    Emley Moor FTC
    No chart for HFT Butt hooks that I know of...........you just need to read the UKAHFT rules and interpret them the best that you can. Dont forget, just to make it even more interesting, not all regions have the same rules regarding butt hooks and HFT ,and do not always follow the UKAHFT rules. If you want the official UKAHFT and you are still not clear you need to speak to Pete Dutton as has already been mentioned.

    Personally I think that you will struggle to set up any gun properly to shoot both FT and HFT with.

    Not quite sure why you are disappointed that there are two disciplines though.:confused: Got to be a good thing as it has brought a lot of shooters into FT and HFT, and a lot shoot both. :cool:
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  7. Mr H.

    Mr H. I am not even a number.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    163
    Location:
    Halesowen.
    Club:
    NARPA - OSS. - Harriers FTC. British Field Target Council - Pre BFTA


    Not quite sure why you are disappointed that there are two disciplines though.:confused: Got to be a good thing as it has brought a lot of shooters into FT and HFT, and a lot shoot both. :cool:[/QUOTE]

    The 2 disciplines used to run as one and it just seems that commercialism has somehow guided the 2 disciplines in different directions. Range-finders -why?
    Club shoots at Stourvale Woodsmen back in early 90;s had 140 + members - average club Sunday shoot - 40 shooters.

    MFTA charity shoot at Arley back in 1988 we had literally hundreds of shooters there as we ran an Airgunner Grand Prix leg and an Airgun World Showdown shoot at the same time the winner was Pete Snatchfold. 580 entrants that day.

    The only down side to that day was Dave Hammill with his floppy hat in his flowery shorts asking for butter on his bacon sandwich.

    In case anyone thinks this is sour grapes it is not. I cannot see why we are pricing the new shooters out of the sport at the very beginning. 15mm kills doesn't encourage anybody to spend loads of money to get a gun for the son or daughter for them to get no-where and then dis-illusioned they leave not to return. Good marketing that Eh!

    Sorry rant over

    Oh and setting the gun and scope up for both FT and HFT is easier than you think
     
  8. DEAN C.

    DEAN C. Steyr Convert

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2009
    Messages:
    852
    Location:
    Doncaster
    Club:
    Emley Moor FTC
    Well actually my older daughter is having a go at HFt again!! The only reason she stopped before was due to travelling and work getting in the way, I am pretty sure mini kills never scared her.In fact there are some very promising young shooters coming through the ranks.

    I know what you are saying about two disciplines but Ft just spiralled into expensive kit as you know, but HFT really came about to take FT back to its roots where you were all shooting 3x9 scopes which I think is a good thing. PS Dave Hammil appears on the scene now and then, not seen his flowery shorts though.

    regarding setting up a FT/HFT gun, yeah you can, but it will be full of compromises. The only FT scopes that can be used sensibly for HFt are the 8x32x40 Burris or Bushnells in my opinion. But hey ho you know best, I've only been shooting for 40 years and HFT comps for 10, what do I know.:D
    I will bet you end up with two guns though!


    Interesting to get your views on the sport now though.No offence meant, so good luck and welcome back.:D
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  9. handbylt

    handbylt New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2013
    Messages:
    205
    Location:
    chesterfield
    Club:
    TCom.hft+Kingsley HFT
    Nostalgia...ita funny old thing..innit
    that buttuck hook looks like it came from lovehoney.com ...not that I ever heard of them o'course
    why not take the P...thats what HFT is all about I thought...the shooting is just secondary..I think..:D:D
     
  10. Where's Molly

    Where's Molly Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2009
    Messages:
    994
    Location:
    purleigh essex
    Club:
    M.A.D
    The 2 disciplines used to run as one and it just seems that commercialism has somehow guided the 2 disciplines in different directions. Range-finders -why?
    Club shoots at Stourvale Woodsmen back in early 90;s had 140 + members - average club Sunday shoot - 40 shooters.

    MFTA charity shoot at Arley back in 1988 we had literally hundreds of shooters there as we ran an Airgunner Grand Prix leg and an Airgun World Showdown shoot at the same time the winner was Pete Snatchfold. 580 entrants that day.

    The only down side to that day was Dave Hammill with his floppy hat in his flowery shorts asking for butter on his bacon sandwich.

    In case anyone thinks this is sour grapes it is not. I cannot see why we are pricing the new shooters out of the sport at the very beginning. 15mm kills doesn't encourage anybody to spend loads of money to get a gun for the son or daughter for them to get no-where and then dis-illusioned they leave not to return. Good marketing that Eh!

    Sorry rant over

    Oh and setting the gun and scope up for both FT and HFT is easier than you think[/QUOTE]





    I dont think the butt hook will be any good for HFT or FT for that fact as it may well interfere with the chip thats on you shoulder.
    All the best.
    Rich.
     
  11. Mr H.

    Mr H. I am not even a number.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    163
    Location:
    Halesowen.
    Club:
    NARPA - OSS. - Harriers FTC. British Field Target Council - Pre BFTA
    Cheers,

    No offence taken, obviously what I have learnt and tried since starting F.T. shooting back in the early 80's gives me a good insight on how to set up the gun and scope and overcome any quirks that may arise. It's just a shame I spent so much time being on FT committees and not fully enjoying shooting as I should have done.

    Anyway I am back to enjoy the shooting this time.
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  12. Tench

    Tench WHFTA World Champion 2016.

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2009
    Messages:
    1,719
    Location:
    derby
    You might be able to get away with using one set up for both disciplines if you don't want to be competitive at either. HFT on it's own is a compromise of settings to best achieve what you see as important and what you can afford to fudge a bit without having to compromise further to make it also make a little sense for FT. You need 2 rifles, then there are no butt hook issues either.
     
  13. vinny

    vinny WHFTA 2015 World Champion

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2014
    Messages:
    685
    Location:
    essex
    Club:
    M.A.D
    2.25 inches mate , not 2.5:), I share your pain , sometimes best not ask the definitive questions , if it aint defined it cant b enforced, before the windicator rule came out in hft people wanted a definitive, grass , sawdust talc ciggaretts etc ,be careful on what question you ask out there,
    I filed about 1\4 inch of a ftp paddle to make it comply with previous federation definitions :D
     
  14. Mr H.

    Mr H. I am not even a number.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    163
    Location:
    Halesowen.
    Club:
    NARPA - OSS. - Harriers FTC. British Field Target Council - Pre BFTA
    Cheers Tench and Vinny, the problem I have is the action I am using is so efficient and accurate.

    So I will have to look at some other way round my problem.

    Cheers,

    It's got me thinking now.


    Mark
     
  15. cocksure

    cocksure Weihrauch flasher mac....

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2013
    Messages:
    679
    Location:
    Yorkshire
    Awful isn't it..?

    I fully agree that having an efficient and accurate gun can be a real problem..........have you considered buying a Daystate to overcome the accuracy problem? There are many guns that return few accurate shots per fill, there by being inefficient AND inacurate, the perfect gun...???? I confused, do I look confused...is this my confused face?

    Good luck....
     
  16. Mr H.

    Mr H. I am not even a number.

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2016
    Messages:
    163
    Location:
    Halesowen.
    Club:
    NARPA - OSS. - Harriers FTC. British Field Target Council - Pre BFTA
    Ok -so if you eat those mushrooms shown in your avatar this is what happens. I have never seen a confused mushroom - so thank-you.
     
  17. bigwalk

    bigwalk Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2009
    Messages:
    72
    Location:
    Cumbria
    So could I have this , a total length of 6cm ?
     

    Attached Files:

  18. what barn door

    what barn door Now them tin chickens are going to get it....

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2014
    Messages:
    739
    Location:
    crewe, cheshire
    Club:
    Kingsley
    Mr H, if you care to stop and think about it for a moment. Lets say that no kill smaller than 25 mm, no nearer than 12 yards, no further away than 35 yards. Then your newcomers might come flocking, but what happens once they have shot a few times?

    They find it almost too easy and give up, or they push the boundaries and have what we have now, it's not a new phenomenen it's called evolution and it seems to be working just fine.
     
  19. what barn door

    what barn door Now them tin chickens are going to get it....

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2014
    Messages:
    739
    Location:
    crewe, cheshire
    Club:
    Kingsley
    Just read that back and it sounds a bit harsh, not intentional Mr H, but I hope you see the point I was trying to make.
     
  20. bootneckbob

    bootneckbob Active Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2009
    Messages:
    610
    Location:
    Northam
    Club:
    Shebbear
    I agree with most of the points made regarding the two guns for HFT FT but it does depend on your region and rules.

    UKAHFT and BFTA absolutely you will struggle and not be really competitive unless you are truly amazing at range estimation with your HFT scope at 50-55 yard (let alone the rest of the course). It does happen though.

    Down in the South West, SWEFTA rules mean you can actually shoot HFT and FT with the same setup. There's pro's and cons to that and we've debated them at length down here, but for guys who only want to shoot no higher than regional level it's actually quite a good system. I shouldn't forget to mention we do have a few who venture out of the region from time to time including the World springer champion and European champion.

    I've finally resigned myself to shooting both with just the FT rig. If you haven't read the rules don't say you can't do it because you can (its just like extreme rules, but its always extreme).
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice