HFT Barrel thoughts

Discussion in 'Hunter (HFT) & Field Target (FT)' started by cowandchicken, Nov 2, 2018.

  1. cowandchicken

    cowandchicken New Member

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    If my gun shoots most well known brands to an equal standard, Does this mean I have a good barrel compared to a bad barrel that is pellet fussy?
     
  2. blacklab

    blacklab Member

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    miracles do happen :D:D:D:D
     
  3. NeilM

    NeilM Well-Known Member

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    Sounds good, but how accurate? And at what range?
     
  4. cowandchicken

    cowandchicken New Member

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    35 yds and within 25m kill. but I am a newbe.
     
  5. NeilM

    NeilM Well-Known Member

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    Not bad.

    Put out some paper at 25 yards with just dots marked on it, and concentrating hard fire five shots at each dot, using different pellets for each string.

    It does not matter where the pellets land, just keep concentrating on the dot you are shooting at.

    Try to do this on a calm day, but even if it is a little breezy you will still end up with a series of groups that show if your barrel prefers one pellet over another.

    If there is little difference between each group, then you have a very unfussy barrel, I have a couple of rifles like this, but even the un-fussiest barrel has a favourite.
     
  6. cowandchicken

    cowandchicken New Member

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    Out of all tested AA Diablo Field would be my choice but by a very very slim margin.
     
  7. Dan Smith

    Dan Smith Emley extreme sh!te shot champ

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    Don’t listen to them!!

    If your gun is good with different pellets then step away from pellet testing immediately - if you don’t it will get into your head forever....
     
  8. cowandchicken

    cowandchicken New Member

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    Thanks for the advice.:)
     
  9. skires

    skires Well-Known Member

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    Neil was politely trying to tell you that what you are considering as an acceptable standard at the moment may not be indicating the best pellet for your rifle.

    If the rifle is rested on a still day then most target shooters would want half an inch or better at 35 yards. Some would want that at 55 yards.

    So saying your rifle will shoot a range of well known pellets and they all land inside a 25mm kill at 35 yards isn't really testing the barrel/pellet relationship of your gun.

    Most will test pellets and pellet batches until they are achieving cloverleaf groups at 35 yards and sub 3/4 inch groups at 55 yards.

    You say you are a newbie. The shooters testing for the groups I mentioned above will probably have the confidence in their ability to know that they are capable of those groups with the right barrel/pellet, so their testing is actually testing the barrel/pellet and not their own skills.

    So maybe you need to get some more confidence in your own grouping abilities before worrying too much about the barrel/pellet's capabilities.

    Hence why Neil's idea was a good start to drag the range back in to quite close range, and 25 yards is probably about right or you could try 20 or 15 at first. On a still day rest the rifle on a bag(s) and do as Neil says and shoot at dots. Say 10 pellets at each dot and then try the next dot and the next pellet. You may find that you start eliminating the worst pellet. When you are confident that you are getting very tight groups at that range ( with the right pellet you should be just getting one ragged hole at that range ) then move the targets further away and see if another pellet is eliminated as worst.

    What rifle are you using?

    If you are happy with just shooting targets and getting sub 25mm groups at 35 yards at the moment, then that's absolutely fine. Just keep shooting one of those pellets for a while and enjoy knocking down what you can, until you feel ready that you need to move on to the next step and maybe look at finding a pellet/batch that will tighten your groups up a tad more.

    Don't let the testing get in the way of enjoying. The testing, when you are ready, will be there to help you knock down a few more targets and then you may enjoy it a bit more. It's not a race. Everyone develops at their own pace and takes target shooting as seriously as they wish.
     
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  10. cowandchicken

    cowandchicken New Member

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    That's some well thought out experienced advice. Thank you for your feed back. I am on the hft trail with a R10 and into week 3 and loving every moment.
    Any more info you can give will be greatly received.
     
  11. skires

    skires Well-Known Member

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    Okay so you are using a BSA R10.

    BSA changed the process on these barrels slightly over the last few years. They started polishing the barrels.

    Some of the earlier barrels did seem a tad pellet fussy. The two BSA 0.177 barrels that I had would shoot all pellets under an inch at 35 yards but the groups were larger ( not really acceptable ) with JSB/AA pellets. My barrels much preferred either Bisley Magnums at 10.6gr or Crosman Premiers ( the proper ones in the boxes ) at 7.9gr. This was a common story for BSA owners.

    The polishing on the more modern barrels may mean that the newer barrels shoot JSB/AA pellets just as well.

    I would still bet that you would try Bis Mags ( AKA Barracuda ) at 10.6gr and your barrel will shoot them as accurately as anything else you try. The only issue with that is they are heavier than AA Field and the trajectory will be steeper. HFT is only out to 45 yards and a number of very good shooters have used heavy pellets and done very well. You do need to be a tad more accurate estimating range on some targets but the heavies tend to not drift as much in the wind.

    If you do go down the road of testing and find that the AA Field won't group much better than say 3/4 inch at35 yards, then try some Bis Mags. They will cloverleaf in most BSA 0.177 barrels at that range. The Crosman Premier in a box 7.9gr is a light alternative that should shoot very well in your BSA barrel.

    Just to complicate things ... H&N have recently released a pellet called Barracuda FT. This is a 9.57gr pellet. Reports suggest that it is on the large size ( like the Bis Mags and Crosman Premiers in the boxes ) so will probably go well in BSA barrels. I haven't tried them in my BSA barrel yet.

    I'm presuming you are using 0.177 for HFT. If you have a 0.22 R10 then the 0.22 barrels weren't all that fussy.

    If you are using your R10 for HFT then most clubs/venues/comps will insist you remove the magazine in between pegs. No magazines are allowed in the rifle away from the peg for safety ( even if they have no pellets in them ). That can be a pain in the backside and some magazines can also cause poor groupings. You may want to look at using a single shot adaptor for HFT. You just leave the adaptor in the rifle and then flick it open and load a pellet at each peg. So no messing about removing and fitting the magazine at the peg and getting an earful from marshalls when you've forgotten to take it out. There is an option of an adaptor that you just roll the pellet in.
     
  12. Nomads HFT

    Nomads HFT Active Member

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    All good advice as usual, Col but, in this instance, Stu Hill went to some lengths after the shoot yesterday to map out Jason's aim points with AA Field, so I think it best if Jason shoots at least one course with them before considering testing any other pellets.

    Jason's rifle is indeed .177" and he already has a single shot adaptor.
     
  13. skires

    skires Well-Known Member

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    So he's in good hands Jim.

    That's why I said the above in my messages.

    Good luck Jason and enjoy.
     
  14. cowandchicken

    cowandchicken New Member

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    Hi, Thank you for the advice. A lot of what you say backs up the testing I have done so far. AA field seem to give as good as it gets with me behind the gun while your right in saying the Bisley magnums shoot well also and would be my second choice. I have had a go at mapping my aim points twice and come up with two different sets of points! As mentioned Stu put a lot of time in getting me on the right track this week so for the time being my pellet testing days and aim points are behind me till I know more what I am doing and can shoot to a better standard where I may feel the pellets are more at fault than myself. This I feel could be many years from now.
    Many thanks.
     
  15. C.Eaton

    C.Eaton Confirmed Anschutz Nut...

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    Just to add an extra variable, velocity plays a part in that you might find that a pellet that doesn't group at say 795fps, is an absolute one-hole stunner at 770fps so if you find a promising pellet try a couple of different velocities (still keeping legal) just to see if things get better or worse.
     
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  16. kjedroska

    kjedroska New Member

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  17. Adam

    Adam Active Member

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    I would say a good barrel is a good barrel. Coupled with a powerplant that's capable of providing a consistent air pulse and half decent pellets, it should group. With a good powerplant and mega pellets, it should be awesome. But it should still be decent enough with the average batches.

    A bad barrel is going to struggle to put in a group with any pellet. Though you might find a magic batch that it "likes", you'll mainly get so-so performance.

    What I think happens is that most barrels and most pellet batches are somewhere around the middle of a bell curve of consistency/quality. You get outliers at either end of the curves.
    So a combo of a so-so barrel with mega pellets gives decent grouping, as does a mega barrel with so-so pellets.

    Hence if you have an average barrel (which by definition most people do) then you're either always on the hunt for the mega pellets, or you'll have to be satisfied with average performance.
     
  18. luddite

    luddite I Love HFT

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    @Adam.
    I agree with your first point, a good barrel by virtue of being a good barrel will be a good barrel.
    Your point about the powerplant though raises some queries...
    Do you carry it around in a plant pot, and how do you get the pulses down your barrel?
    I usually put mine into soup.
     
  19. Adam

    Adam Active Member

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    @luddite Ideally you need a root veg powerplant; parsnips are good, but carrots will do at a pinch.
    Some pulses will go down the barrel but only if they're the right calibre. I find split lentils sized to 4.52 are good if soaked in pilchard oil.
     
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