Adding clicks

Discussion in 'Hunter (HFT) & Field Target (FT)' started by Gibbs, Feb 3, 2012.

  1. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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    Having recently changed from hold over to dialing, I'm on a bit of a learning curve and have come up with a question.
    Previously, I would go to the zero range, check my aimpionts and dial out any error with a few clicks on the elevation turret. Job done. All my aim points were then spot on.(Or were they?)

    But now, I find the number of clicks I need to add varies according to the distance!? ie. more clicks for the longer targets, and therefore less/no clicks for the closer ones.

    So my question is, When you need to adjust, do you add more clicks for the longer ones than the close ones?

    Atb,

    Alec.
     
  2. Jamesy

    Jamesy Weerach ninja

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    Yes.:D
    As the distance from your primary zero increases you will have to add more and more clicks to compensate. Make a note of the position of the turret for every given range, 40 yards, 45 yards etc... and then when you sight a target you can easily adjust the elevation to suit.:)
     
  3. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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    So previously with holdover when I thought I was "resetting" my zero, I wasn't.
    I was pushing the close or the long ones out of sinc!?

    It would have been the close ones that were out, because I would always check my zero on the longest possible target (dependant on wind) and adjust to that.
    So the error would have only shown up on the closer mini kills.
     
  4. CoolId

    CoolId New Member

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    Probably - I'm currently adding about 8% to the number of clicks. I haven't had a chance to test whether this is a creeping zero or a consequence of the lower temperatures since December and while it stays this cold I may never find out - but it seems to work

    Regards

    Dave
     
  5. neilL

    neilL New Member

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    question is why you need to

    Hi
    I would think the real issue is why should you need to adjust the offset for zero? If it is purely mechanical (mounts moving, effect of temperature on the gun or scope geometry, etc) then it shouldn't matter very much for other distances. With the current low temperatures the air is 'thicker' so the trajectories are affected across the range and that will mean new aim points regardless of hold-over or elevation clicks. Then there is humidity and altitude, effect on regulator (fps), etc, etc.

    Odds are the temperature will change over the duration of the course so it will come down to the usual "hmm try this one with a few more clicks or give it a few more yards holdover".

    All adds to the fun of target shooting outdoors in the UK weather :)

    Cheers
    Neil
     
  6. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    Normally, i'll just add clicks all the way through. It may not be correct, but as you come closer the clicks make less difference anyway...

    If you want to be clever shoot at 50yds and at 25 and measure in MOA and just blend between the two.

    This is why i'm looking at the kestrel thing, because it seems in winter the trajectory is different. In SA, most saw a lift at 55, but nothing at 25... suggesting the pellets were flying flatter. In winter therefore it's not off the wall to think they're looping more to denser air... hence the Kestrel and looking into Density Altitude. SA was 4000ft + sea level. We've seen shifts 2500 ft below sea level. Little wonder the trajectory trend has been reversed.
     
  7. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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    I think it's relatively standard practice to add/subtract clicks when you find the POI has changed (from shoot to shoot)
    So to answer the question "why" It's certainly not the scope moving about! But could be a number of other things.
    If damp air is slowing down the pellet more than normal, then it stands to reason that some adjustment needs to be made.

    If the gun is producing the change in POI (as apposed to the atmospherics) then my old method of dialling out the difference and leaving it would have been ok.
    But if it's atmospherics changing the POI, then I would expect the shape of the trajectory to be different, thus needing a more complicated solution. ie more clicks for longer ranges.
    I hope I'm making sense here!?

    Atb,

    Alec.
     
  8. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    You are. I think you're right. But adding clicks is a simple solution... i've lifted and shifted my turret through the winter as I saw fit and it works fine, even though i know it's not bang on. If I need to at 1 MOA at the long range then i can still get away with 1 MOA out close in.

    1 MOA = 1 inch at 100yds, or 1/2" at 50yds.. but at 12.5yds it's 1/4". So adding 4x1/4 MOA or 8x1/8 MOA is a big deal down range, but not too much of a niggle at reducer ranges... Probably the most problematic would be 25yd 15mm's... but then you can check those at the plinking range.

    This is why i carry numbers on a card and dont use a marked turret. If i need to add 6 clicks at 55 and none at 25 then all i need to do is add 1 click at 30, 2 at 35, 3 at 40, 4 at 45, 5 at 50 and 6 at 55... a quick scribble on my bit of paper and i'm off. Those who have preset numbers on their dials have to remember the offset. My brain aint that big.
     
  9. aitchuk

    aitchuk Member

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    I find a simple way is to shoot at 55yds and make any adjustments adding or subtracting
    clicks then reset my turret to the normal number.
    So if 55yds is normaly 40 clicks and I have to add 5 clicks to maintain poi at 55 I leave the scope set at
    45 clicks undo the top turret and set it at 40. All ranges then should be with in a pellet whith

    hope this makes sence
    Aitch
     
  10. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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    Thank's for the replies,
    I was thinking of writing the offset on the scope cover with a non permanent silver marker. I thought one offset figure would be enough but last week at E.Devon I was 14 clicks low at 55yrds!! and only a couple of clicks low at 8yrds So I guess I will need a few figures on my scope cap. (As you do with your card Rob)

    All of this adjustment and checking might become a little fiddly at an unknown shoot with a questionable zero range and a strong wind!!

    Still, as said already, It's all part of the fun of FT!

    Atb,

    Alec.
     
  11. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    That's the quick and dirty solution, which I use on the plinking range, but if i'm working with a constant shift i like to redo my ranges, then i know next shoot i wont be far off.
     
  12. rich

    rich Active Member

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    Part of the 14 clicks needed might be your scope telling you the target was at say 52 yards whereas in truth it was at 55 yards. Now that alone must be worth about six clicks. In this very cold weather my T35 shows this amount of under-reading.
     
  13. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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    I see what your saying Rich, but having had so much trouble with my old Big Nikko I am very conscious of temp ranging issues. I haven't seen more than a couple of yards shift with my Sightron and all it does is slightly under range the long ones in the cold. So the first thing I do when I get to a shoot is get the gun out to settle for half an hour minimum, then check the scope on the 55 a couple of times and then I have no trouble at all (even in the darkness of the woods) So I can rule out the scope. And on Sunday I didn't miss any high or low. (except for miss reading my wheel and going one and half turns out!!- pillock!:eek:)

    Thank's Rob,
    I now understand why so many people don't mark their wheel or turret directly! I may have to go down that route, although I would prefer not to for the sake of simplicity.

    Atb,

    Alec.
     
  14. RobF

    RobF Administrator Staff Member

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    That's just my take on it. But then I can lose my numbers. But then I know a couple who have had loose turrets...

    Yes, as Rich says, you do need to make certain it's not scope shift. But I do like you, range a target first before even firing a shot. It does mean thought that I like to know something is 55 on the plinking range. But knowing my scope more I know when it's likely to be it, and when it's not.

    But I think the change in environment seems to play far more weight than pellets being driven up or down by breeze... at Meon, I brought the targets in and there was a predominant low shift, even in the 40's people were going in low. My scope under ranges as heat increases, if others are the same then it would suggest environment is at play. I had the kestrel out and saw it drop from 600 to 1000 ft below... those that got on the course early seemed to be the ones that suffered as I saw a corresponding drop while I ran the stats.
     
  15. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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  16. Woody

    Woody The Chaser!

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  17. NJR 100

    NJR 100 Because I`m AWESIME !!

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  18. Gibbs

    Gibbs New Member

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  19. paul4be

    paul4be Why do I bother????????

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    I think most would look at their primary zero as the reference point that they return to after dialing for a shot. In my case for example, that would be 35 yards. Yes as I dial for a shot at a given range, my scope should be zero'd for that specific distance, but the zero distance that I return to and work out from for all other distances is 35 yards.
     
  20. rich

    rich Active Member

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    I choose my zero as the distance where the peak of the pellet flight forms a tangent with the optical axis of the scope. For a typical FT set up that is something around 25 yards, depending on mount height.

    Then, all my dialling is in the same direction; short targets and long targets, I always dial upwards. After each shot I return the top turret back past the zero point then bring it up to zero. The idea is that I take out any backlash in the turret.
     

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